The Bosch motor produces the same 85Nm peak torque output as Shimano EP8, and it offers a similarly drag-free ride quality beyond the 25km/h cutoff due to the motor decoupling from the cranks. Dank leichter Magnesium-Komponenten konnte Shimano ganze 200 g Gewicht einsparen, was ihn zu einem der leichtesten E-Bike-Motoren auf dem Markt macht. Really? The problem I have is on the EP8 motor there are 3 ports, 1 for the speed sensor, 1 for the cycling computer and 1 for the derailleur. I have no personal experience riding with pedal assist but when I hear the high whiz from the motor I think that would drive me mad too. Its almost as if the battery drains faster in that final 20%. I rode an e bike and suffered a little bit yesterday. - Tuning options are simple and effective We got in touch with several brands to find out if they knew about the issue, whether they were going to continue to spec the e*thirteen cranks with EP8 motors, and what a customer could expect to happen if they encountered this issue. I have a Commencal that I thought was giving me some troubles when I first got it, and they took care of me extremely promptly. Damn, sorry to hear this especially since I own the same bike! Shimanos answers to our questions are published below verbatim. Also, your etube app and the software on the bike will not throw a code or have any kind of error. According to Shimano, the EP8 motor offers a 36% reduction in drag over the old E8000 motor, and we're inclined to believe that claim. What can consumers expect to happen if their EP8s spindle fails? When youre descending down the trail, the volume and resonance are amplified. He started racing downhill at the tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe. Start with a full battery, select the Trail mode, and see how far you can go before you run out of juice. This is part of our COMMENCAL Care program, we consider a warranty case should have no cost at all for any of our customers.. They need to get their old skunk works team back together and gain real world feedback before promoting vaporware. When new the last bar of charge corresponds to roughly 15-20% charge, but over time this becomes 5-10%. The Levo SL? On one ride with the Canyon Spectral:ON, the range estimation initially showed 25km. JavaScript is disabled. I swapped wheels but didn't realize I had to swap the magnet from the rotor bolts that was connected to the speed sensor in the software. If in doubt about such components, we recommend speaking to your bicycle manufacturer.. Once paired, find the Customise menu and select Assist. Occasionally it can feel a little peakier compared to EP8, but for the most part both motors are easy to get used to within a few rides. A bit like chain slap when you don't apply force on the pedals. [The] topic has been closed from Shimano[s] side but e*thirteen is still investigating with independent labs.. IMO we're still in the pilot phase and have a lot of room for improvement. Ive only charged 2x. Again, shift it down one notch at a time to get a feel for the change. I chose this bike because it has the EP8 and from research, seems to be the most reliable platform out there, assuming it's as reliable as the E8000. While I am at the age/account to have one, I couldn't imagine riding longer than my 630W battery lasted, i don't think i would be able to walk for a week. The noise is easily demonstrated if you pick the back wheel up a few inches off the ground and let it come back down. Can we get reviews this in depth for regular bikes? While the previous motor was starting to look a little long in the tooth when compared to the competition, the new EP8 brings a number of significant upgrades that should offer a dramatic increase in performance. Subscribe to Cycling Plus from just 13.50 and get a Lezyne Pocket Drive Pump, worth 29! Cargo Take the load off and breeze past traffic jams Commuting Upgrade your urban lifestyle Active Get sportier in the city SHIMANO CUES Di2 Our all-new SHIMANO CUES Di2 inspires a more active and sportier lifestyle while making commutes less stressful so you can focus on the road - and the ride. Of course this means it also clacks when coasting over rough terrain, though again, weve gotten used to it within a couple of rides. - Lightweight and small form factor My brain constantly struggles with whether 2 bars remaining means I have 21% or 59%I would prefer a continuous power bar or percent. This adjustment has the biggest impact on the motors performance and your total range. Shimano's EP8, short for DU-EP800, features a higher maximum torque of 85Nm compared to the older E8000's 70Nm, topping it by an extra 21%. The Shimano EP8 RS of the Orbea Rise does not present physical differences concerning the EP8 that we can see mounted on other e-mtb's. Its dimensions and weight are the same. oooof! As it stands, you have to use the small button at the base of the display to manually scroll through additional pages just to see your cadence, estimated range and the time. e*thirteen is one of the biggest OEM suppliers of cranks on electric mountain bikes. That kind of thing can destroy a company's reputation even if it's not something serious . I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. It's kinda frustrating. For consumers who do have an EP8-equipped Commencal with e*thirteen cranks, the Andorran brand is offering to replace the e*thirteen cranks with Shimano ones, regardless of whether theyve experienced issues with their EP8 spindle or not. It also depends on the bike too. You can hear it in the workshop just by lifting the rear wheel and dropping it on the ground, where it sounds a bit like a loose pebble bouncing around inside a wooden box. Same with brose 2.1 & their motor failures. Was thinking the same thing. Having spoken with other long-term EP8 and Bosch Gen 4 users, it would appear that for many riders its a non-issue. According to the TSB, only Shimanos EP8 motor is affected. Simply enjoy what you are riding and watch the world, I should say, e-bike world, pass you by, as they are here to stay and while they are not perfect they are probably the best and most exciting thing to happen to the bike industry in 50 years! Plus the prices will drop as the tech becomes cheaper and can be offered at lower prices. This means that if you ride in the default Trail and Boost settings, youll actually end up with a similar total range as the old E8000 motor, albeit with the benefit of more power and assistance throughout the ride. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I suppose pedal assist allows you to tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be effective it needs to be subtle too. Specialized is close to this. Shimano says it provides up to 350-percent support (in Boost mode versus the E8000's 300 percent). Seeing if anyone else out there has had problems with their EP8. What's your experience on this? I thought ebikes were supposed to enable us to do more fun stuff in less time. Additionally, Shimano produces a smaller and lighter 504Wh option, which is also cheaper and helps to bring the complete bike price down see the sub-$8K Polygon Mt Bromo N8 for example. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. The Pivot Shuttle, for example, employs a huge 726Wh battery made by a third party company called Darfon. There are no reported cases of spindle breakage of DU-EP800 when assembled with Shimanos cranks. I have ridden ebikes great fun,addictive, you gain some things , but lose some things as well, like all bikes a compromise. I've had a go on ebikes and think they're fantastic and good fun. I had this happen on my Orbea Rise but with different circumstances. Mkay? If that fails check those thin cables have no freys and are all in tact, they are easily damaged. Still, the performance in the adaptive E-MTB mode is excellent, with smooth and flexible power delivery, and riders wanting plenty of grunt will certainly dig the Bosch motor. Thats given us plenty of saddle time to compare and contrast the new motor not only with E8000, but also with the latest Bosch Gen 4 motor and the Brose-manufactured 2.2 motor in the new Specialized Levo. But it is not anywhere near the same engine in everything else. Over the past six months of riding, the Shimano EP8 motor has really impressed us with just how much punch it delivers from such a lightweight and compact package. Shimano advises that only approved crank arms should be used with its DU-EP8 drive units, reads Shimanos statement. These combinations meet our strict and exacting quality standards. The most prominent reports of EP8 axle failure exist on two EMTB forum threads. Now well point out here that the Bosch Gen 4 motor exhibits a similar metallic clacking noise, since its internal gear system also employs a clutch. It doesn't feel good. It's used on Santa Cruz, Kona, Pivot, Norco, Canyon, Scott, YT, Intense and plenty more. "but since I have to hit the small button repeatedly when my battery charge becomes critical on some rides". Shimano also claims this issue is. Any rider who owns an ebike with an EP8 motor fitted with e*thirteen cranks currently has two options. At full charge in Trail mode it says range is 90km or so but I haven't put that to the test on more mellow trail days but am sure others have. We haven't really got an opinion about durability. These findings are the result of an independently commissioned investigation by e*thirteen, after the brand became aware of reports that EP8 spindles were failing on bikes fitted with its ebike cranks. I haven't had the privelage to ride any bosch equiped bikes or other shimano bikes but this thing is so quiet I think it would be hard to find another ebike motor that is more silent. This, of course, is good news for Commencal customers with EP8 drive units and e*thirteen cranks, and were hopeful other brands will follow suit. I tried to find out the cause of this. Appreciate the level of detail in this article, good work. Bikers Edge in Kaysville Utah hooked it up and took a motor off their demo heckler mx and put it on mine. Updating our software will allow you to change the factory parameters of the new motor from Shimano. Save 30% + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine. Annoying rattle, did anyone say that to Shimano when they first introduced the freewheel? He was pretty happy about ANT compatibility. The maximum rider support was raised to 400%, compared to the E8000's 300%. This is particularly noticeable on traction-poor climbs, even when starting from a standstill. I despise young people buying ebikeswhat a bunch of lazy. I have not heard of a recall, so I did some digging. e*thirteen is at the table with bike brands to find a mutually acceptable solution that first takes care of keeping people on their bikes. All bikes [have been] assembled with Shimano cranks since 2021 April.. So, when the sensor senses a negative elevation gain, the dynamo kicks in to recharge the battery. The three EP8 bikes weve tested all have sub-440mm rear centre lengths, which is quite a bit shorter than the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+ with its much bulkier Yamaha motor, for example. Not everyone has the time to grind for an hour up the climb. Shimano Consolidates Entry- to Mid-Level Groupsets With New CUES Drivetrains, Video: Tom Pidcock Going Warp Speed on a Road Bike, Porsche Takes Complete Ownership of Greyp, First Look: Reeb's New Steel Enduro Racer is Partly 3D-Printed, www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/wanneroo/bicycle-parts-and-accessories/men-s-petrol-bike-mountain-bike-/1259285475, www.cyclevolta.com/story/ebike-components/hold-up-shimanos-new-emtb-motor, www.avdweb.nl/solar-bike/solarbike/maxun-solar-bike. So many issues that can be simply solved by not having a motor. Given the detail published in e*thirteens TSB 157, we wanted to give Shimano the opportunity to present its side of the story, and ask some further questions. The cheapest Specialized Levo is the Expert model, which sells for just shy of $16K. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Step 2 - Identify if preload caps have a pre-applied threadlocker patch and apply if necessary. I also have Commencal 2021 meta power sx. Truly unfortunate you lost it. According to Shimano, the EP8 motor offers a 36% reduction in drag over the old E8000 motor, and were inclined to believe that claim. Its also given us plenty of opportunity to identify all the little quirks, while getting a better impression of long-term durability and performance. Hopefully we will have a system with little weight penalty in a few years. It is the most underrated comment ever on the pinkbike. Weve ridden the latest Bosch Performance CX Gen 4 motor on a variety of e-MTBs, including the Cube Stereo Hybrid 160 and the Trek Rail. Don't worry: "Every time you start your pitchfork, it resets into 'no stab' mode. Bikes sent in for testing are usually carefully prepared by brands to pick up any assembly issues, and then are checked before testing by in-house mechanics or the testers themselves. The downside for Bosch is that its display options leave a lot to be desired. the rattle it because the sprag bearing that used to be used in most motors has been replaced by DT swiss style star ratchet drive rings. I'm not an ebike hater - but (you knew it was coming) - I can't ever see myself being able to justify the expense of one and I wouldn't like to risk a second hand one. If you aren't climbing steeps and requiring the torque, you would get way longer distance. Also the bikes will be heavy as f*ck with an 820Wh battery. Specializeds Mission Control app continues to be the market leader in terms of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness. Come join the discussion about bike parts, components, deals, performance, modifications, classifieds, trails, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! The brand suggests EP8 owners should inspect their motors spindles for damage or cracks originating from the drilled hole used for the pedal crank retainer hook, located on the splined portion of the axle. With 21% greater torque than E8000, the EP8 motor delivers substantially more punch on the trail, and it feels more usable too. Nothing like on an ebike. Personally, were ok with downshifting and spinning our way up a steep incline its better for the health of your knees, and its likely better for the health of the motor too. Wed much rather see battery life displayed as a percentage, and the option to customise the screen. If you are disabled and need a motor on your bike in order to ride, I understand. Let us know what you find out. Upon a little digging on the internet, it appears that this functionality is only on offer for Garmin users. This will be a far more accurate method for determining your estimated range. The current spares situation is shocking, l've been waiting six weeks for a battery lock for my E8000 equipped Kona and have been told "June" is the earliest l can expect to see it. My take away besides the obviously pro/con talking points was the weight of the bike. Generally on bikes we spend so little time braking that regeneration would be a waste of effort. IMO Shimano bikes are good,but they are 2 steps down compared to Specialized and Bosch. So then it gets really confusing as it seems like the first bar lasts 30% and the last one 10%. Recalled but still was delivered with the rattle. This speed may be enough, but some people may find it very frustrating because from 25 km/h they have to make a gigantic effort to follow their teammates since the assistance is cut off or simply because they want to go faster. Most brains will be capable of doing this, as the noise in question isnt actually signalling a fault with the motor. Meanwhile, e*thirteens response places the ball firmly in Shimanos court. Aim for a cadence between 70-90 RPM for maximum efficiency and response from the motor. I had the same issue with my Yamaha but it was last winter. I rode the engine too, the thing is the engine is super quiet once you charge on the pedals, and you've got that annoying rattling noise as soon as you are on the freewheel and cruising down the trail Shim is working on it from what they said. Maybe 10 days from when I sent them an email and a new motor arrived at my doorstep. I run the previous version steps e8000 and I think it's brilliant. "- Only five power bars for charge level.". Overall very pleased with the bike and the motor. On top of that, Shimano also appears to be cool with brands building their bikes with non-Shimano batteries. 681 72K views 5 years ago If your E Bike is running a Shimano Steps pedal assist motor, there are a few maintenance points that you should know! Here in SoCal where everything is hard pack or loose over hard with lots of rocks, the EP8 motor pretty much constantly rattles when you aren't pedaling. Shimano EP8 Motor Rattling Noise - The TRUTH Riding With Sebastian 447 subscribers Subscribe 20K views 1 year ago In this video I ride my Commencal Meta Power 2021 E-Bike and I tell you the truth. Quick everyone, it's another article about e-bikes grab the pitchforks! This also allows brands to more neatly integrate the motor into their frame designs, Canyon having done a particularly swell job with the Spectral:ON. 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